Stacker News Live #127: Weird Bitcoin Transaction with PlebPoet

Stacker News Live #127: Weird Bitcoin Transaction with PlebPoet

Car [00:00:07]:
Hello, Liz. You can. Welcome back to another exciting episode of Stacker D. Is my lady Miss car. The Kia on here? Yeah. How's it going?

Keyan [00:00:13]:
Should we redo that one, too?

Car [00:00:14]:

Keyan [00:00:15]:
Oh, okay.

Car [00:00:16]:
No, I just disconnected for sure.

Keyan [00:00:18]:
I'm savoring my independence today. I feel really.

Car [00:00:22]:
Do you feel freer?

Keyan [00:00:23]:
Shackles of Britain.

Car [00:00:25]:
Did you not feel free yesterday?

Keyan [00:00:27]:
Um. No, I mean it. The once. The ramparts.

Car [00:00:34]:
Red blair.

Keyan [00:00:35]:
Red glare.

Car [00:00:36]:
Red glare.

Keyan [00:00:38]:
Red blair. Sounds like a hot day.

Car [00:00:41]:
Hang on. I know it. It's a red, red stare.

Keyan [00:00:45]:
Oh, and then.

Car [00:00:46]:
Wait. No, red glare. Something. I don't know. Yeah, I need the music for it.

Keyan [00:00:51]:
Yeah. And all I know is you're supposed to take off your hat and hold your heart.

Car [00:00:54]:

Keyan [00:00:55]:
When. When they sing that. Yeah, it was a. It was a good week. And, you know, Austin likes fireworks, so.

Car [00:01:03]:
Dude, it was awesome down there, man. You should have saw it. It was amazing.

Keyan [00:01:07]:
I've been the last two years until we have one of those, like, drone things. I'm. I'm okay. I don't.

Car [00:01:15]:
Well, that was. That was one of the. One of the weird things this time around was, like, the drones were there, and I just kind of wanted somebody to, like, shoot him down. I was just like, dude, you're ruining the experience.

Keyan [00:01:26]:
Oh, they were taking pictures of.

Car [00:01:28]:
Well, there is. If they first started off with just, like, one drone, like, five minutes before. You know, it's just like, that one jerk. Right. That's just, like, gonna do it. Okay, that's fine. And then once it started going, like, everybody sent out their drones, and it just felt very, like, oh, man, this is where we're at.

Keyan [00:01:44]:
Everyone's gonna have a personal drone. It's gonna be following them around everywhere. It's the future, dude.

Car [00:01:50]:
Somebody needs to make, like, a thing where, like, you push a button and all the drones just crash.

Keyan [00:01:54]:
Yeah. Like one of those, like, the EMF things.

Car [00:01:57]:
Yeah, that would be cool for drones, but, yeah, I think that was the only thing that kind of ruined the experience a little bit, but it was still really cool.

Keyan [00:02:05]:
Yeah, I don't. I don't even understand what people's fascination is with recording fireworks. Like, who wants to watch a recording of fireworks?

Car [00:02:12]:
Well, they want to watch it in their, like, you know, apple glass stuff, dude. To replay it live. And they just kind of sat around.

Keyan [00:02:19]:
Do they do that?

Car [00:02:20]:
Like, apple's pitching people on the whole thing, that you can relive these memories. Ew.

Keyan [00:02:26]:
I never. I don't even, like normal memories. No matter what I want, there's a.

Car [00:02:30]:
Group of people that. There's a group of people that want. That. Yeah. They want to be able to relive. They want to relive those memories and then they also want to live to be 2000 years old.

Keyan [00:02:40]:
Oh, well, wouldn't. I mean, being 2000 years old might be interesting.

Car [00:02:46]:
I don't know. I feel like you would just get bored with it.

Keyan [00:02:48]:
I'm just kind of. I'm kind of curious what I look like. All, like, shriveled up, 2000 years old.

Car [00:02:52]:
I mean, I'm sure you would take some stuff to live past, you know, the first hundred.

Keyan [00:02:57]:
Yeah. Like. Yeah, like cow testosterone.

Car [00:03:00]:
I think. I think honestly, like, if I'm really thinking about. I think I'd rather have clones than people living past. Do you know what I mean?

Keyan [00:03:06]:
That's what children are.

Car [00:03:08]:
That's what.

Keyan [00:03:09]:
That's basically what children are.

Car [00:03:10]:
Well, yeah, yeah, I know, but, like, if, like, if we had to choose between two pathways is like, clone cloning ism or whatever. Or like, ageism cloning ism.

Keyan [00:03:18]:
Did you just combine clone and then, or agency?

Car [00:03:21]:
I would really rather just, like, do clones. Do you know what I mean?

Keyan [00:03:26]:

Car [00:03:29]:
Like, let's say you die.

Keyan [00:03:30]:
Why not?

Car [00:03:31]:
I like, 20 years from now. I'd rather just clone you.

Keyan [00:03:33]:
Why not have an immortal army of clones of yourself, given the choice?

Car [00:03:39]:
No, they need to probably, like, stop people from doing multiple clones. Too many clones. I could be into clones.

Keyan [00:03:46]:
I don't know. You want to regulate whether I can have.

Car [00:03:49]:
Well, maybe the first step. Maybe the first step is just like an Android clone. Maybe that's it.

Keyan [00:03:56]:
Sounded like cloning ism to me. A car. Sound like a colonialist.

Car [00:04:03]:
That would be hilarious if you've never seen this crazy show. It's about Stacker Dotnews, the front page of bitcoin. It's the only place that I know of that you can go and get sets for posting links, which is kind of nuts.

Keyan [00:04:18]:
You can do that on Noster, too.

Car [00:04:19]:
Oh, you can?

Keyan [00:04:20]:
Yeah, that's what I heard.

Car [00:04:21]:
Okay, well, noster too. But what's cool about this place is you get to read what the stackers want to talk about, what they want to see and what they want to vote on. This is where every week we have to cover this. And sometimes I don't even want to cover it.

Keyan [00:04:36]:

Car [00:04:36]:
Like today there's a couple top stories where I'm like, man, shaking my head. I'm like, man, car. Don't want to talk about that.

Keyan [00:04:42]:
But none of them are about e cash.

Car [00:04:44]:
I know, but it's just one of those things where it's just like, you know, you're, you kind of work in the ecosystem and the last thing you want to do is, you know, say the wrong thing. If that makes any sense.

Keyan [00:04:54]:
Who, who's gonna care? People watch this show, coop, no one watches the show but your sister.

Car [00:05:00]:
We have a person here.

Keyan [00:05:02]:
We have an audience member. It's a paid shell car.

Car [00:05:07]:
Anyways, let's jump into the the top five stories of the week. The first top story is new major release. Phoenix Android Slash iOS slash server now supports bolt twelve. This is from RC 25 Lightning territory 16 comments 3806 sats Kiyom what's this?

Keyan [00:05:23]:
This is Bolt twelve. So Bolt twelve has seen. It's for, I think it's first major release and a popular I don't node implementation. Phoenix is probably one of the most popular.

Car [00:05:36]:
I like the Jetsons reference here, mobile.

Keyan [00:05:39]:
Phone node wallet, lightning node wallet things. And they put bolt twelve in it, which is a pretty big deal otherwise. The other biggest popular implementation is maybe L and D. But L and D doesn't support Bolt twelve yet. So this is maybe the next biggest thing, the second biggest way that bolt twelve can come to people. And it's here, it's there. I still think you have to open your node to receive, unless you have Google play services that can wake up your phone when it receives a payment. There was another thread on stacker news where they were, a bunch of people were trying it out.

Keyan [00:06:28]:
I don't have Phoenix so because I'm America all the way and they're not in America anymore so I don't get to use it. But yeah, really cool. I'm excited about bolt twelve. I think it'll be, it'll be awesome. I think Lisa calls it lightning version two.

Car [00:06:49]:
Oh nice.

Keyan [00:06:50]:
And so this is lightning version two.

Car [00:06:52]:
Got now with the top comment he says Phoenix is solid and in some ways it's good that it's not in the us app store because it pushes people to install it directly from async or from alternative store use. More private slash open os like grapheneos. Travel more outside. Okay. Ek said, wow async just delivers. Need to test that out soon. Entropy bearer says. So cool from their GitHub.

Car [00:07:14]:
I was definitely not expecting bolt twelve support so soon. Gonna have to try it asap. Tamales says, I feel like bolt twelve on Phoenix could almost replace BTC pay server. Really?

Keyan [00:07:27]:
Yeah. You would just need a way to, you would need like a web hook or something to be like oh, this is paid.

Car [00:07:34]:
Oh so you're saying maybe just like you could basically have all the plumbing as far as like the Shopify store and then the last piece is just the. When it gets to the payment.

Keyan [00:07:44]:
Well, you have this thing that can receive payments pretty easily and you don't need to communicate with it all the time. You show to the customer the rightbolt twelve and it pays to your Phoenix wallet. And if your Phoenix wallet has a way of communicating to you or your, I don't know, your payment system, whatever you use at a store that it was paid, boom, you're done. That's all you need.

Car [00:08:15]:
I guess I'm trying to figure out then how is that any different than just an ln URL address?

Keyan [00:08:20]:
You could do something similar with ln URL, but for ln URL you need a web server running.

Car [00:08:25]:
Well, yeah, I know that, but what would be the biggest difference in this kind of. I'm more talking about the BTC pay. Replace the BTC pay server. What's the more. Do you understand what I'm trying to say or am I saying it too fast in my head?

Keyan [00:08:35]:
Well, I don't.

Car [00:08:36]:
I guess what I think I answered.

Keyan [00:08:37]:
Your question already is my main. Was it the question I thought you were asking?

Car [00:08:41]:
So if it's just a static QR code, then how will it replace BTC pay server?

Keyan [00:08:48]:
Because you don't need a web server. You don't need something like BTC pay server to be generating invoices for you.

Car [00:08:58]:
Oh, that's what he means. Okay, that makes sense then.

Keyan [00:09:04]:
Yeah, because you just have these static ones and they scan them.

Car [00:09:08]:
So hypothetically you could just create like your own shopping cart experience and then just add like a bolt twelve.

Keyan [00:09:19]:
Yeah, for like each product you have.

Car [00:09:20]:
A bolt twelve and total shopping.

Keyan [00:09:24]:
That's what I imagine it would work.

Car [00:09:25]:

Keyan [00:09:25]:
But I don't know exactly.

Car [00:09:26]:
So we should figure that out.

Keyan [00:09:28]:
Well, I think it will come pretty soon.

Car [00:09:31]:
Pretty cool.

Keyan [00:09:32]:
Yeah, very cool.

Car [00:09:34]:
That was fast.

Keyan [00:09:35]:
They also have contact lists now, so you can like, I think it'll save the bolt twelve for any, for anyone you like. You know, you identify in the app and so you can. I can pay you without you having to send me an invoice. Now if we're both using Phoenix. Yeah, which is cool.

Car [00:09:55]:
All right, cool. The next top stories is analysis of zero XB 10 C's weird bitcoin transaction. This is a super testnet post. July 1, bitcoin territory 51 comments 25.

Keyan [00:10:09]:
Caseats you yeah, someone did some like bitcoin transaction art. You know, not not maybe art in the sense of like, they drew a pretty picture, but, but art in the sense, it's not like an NFT, but it's like, it's like to, it's kind of like, I don't know, it's like, it's like information art. They did like a bunch of fun things with a transaction where they used all the input types and they did. They like a lot of the, a lot of the amounts that they're sending are like, you know, they're special dates and all kinds of stuff. And super tries to figure out all the things that they did and report on them. And the, the person who created the transaction came in the comment comments and responded as an on. And he signed his messages or their messages demonstrating that they, they were in fact the person who created the transaction. And.

Keyan [00:11:20]:
Yeah, he said there's more stuff to be found in it. Super did not find all the stuff even though we found a bunch of stuff.

Car [00:11:27]:
Oh, interesting. Yeah, we got monoticle. He says, bc one pf e s r a w g f is the correct address rendering for this output since it is a valid segwit v one witness program, even though the combination of witness version and program length does not correspond to any defined spending rules.

Keyan [00:11:48]:
Yeah, he created, he created a two byte output script. And so I don't know how you do that. I don't know how much of this stuff happens because I'm not like super base chain y, but I don't know, really fun. This is something that I imagine was a lot of fun to do.

Car [00:12:12]:
What would they do this for?

Keyan [00:12:14]:
Just for, you know, for, for the same reason anyone makes a piece of art.

Car [00:12:19]:
Just to kind of just so like kind of learn and see.

Keyan [00:12:21]:
Yeah, learn just to kind of express themselves. Like, look at all this cool stuff I can do.

Car [00:12:27]:
Oh, interesting.

Keyan [00:12:28]:
Look at the things I find important that I want to, I want to transmit to you, that kind of thing.

Car [00:12:35]:
Oliver Weiss says so many details, it feels like it is you doing this. And super testant says, it wasn't me. I would have done it on testnet. It's totally a super answer.

Keyan [00:12:48]:
Maybe they did do it on Testnet already and then they went live with it. But I think it was, I think super sat, it was expensive.

Car [00:12:54]:

Keyan [00:12:54]:
I didn't know what the fees were.

Car [00:12:55]:
On it, but you look over here, it's $43.

Keyan [00:13:00]:
Okay. That's not too bad. I think maybe he meant expensive in terms of they, they ended up doing like a bunch of my, they made like the transaction id have a bunch of leading zeros. And maybe that's what he means was expensive because he had to, like, mine it.

Car [00:13:17]:
Cool. Good post. Yeah, it's very, it's very techy week, technical week on Snacker news. The next top story is bitcoin is illegal because it is not legal tender. This is from Darth Coin, July 1, bitcoin bitners territory. 28 comments 4k sats what is this?

Keyan [00:13:39]:
So Darth Coin continues his series, bitcoin deniers myths, debunked BDMD, and this is number three. But he's, he's helping us understand what legal tender is. And apparently what legal tender is, is if you take out. This is how Darth coin describes it. If you take out a loan and the loan terms do not state the currency or the method of repayment in it, then whoever issued the loan to you has to accept legal, anything deemed legal tender as payment for the loan. That's what legal tender is. And so it's, I guess the technical definition is it's the thing that the government allows you to discharge debts that otherwise aren't. That don't, aren't contractually stipulated to be in some other currency.

Keyan [00:14:41]:
And so it's like, basically it's not that big of a deal to have legal tender. I mean, it would be in the case where I, I mean, darth doesn't pay taxes, but for people who pay taxes, if bitcoin were legal tender, the government would, by its own legal tender laws, have to accept bitcoin as payment for taxes because taxes are kind of, are basically a debt. But, yeah, that's what he does to describe it here. And he goes on to describe other things about how bitcoin is not seen as money by the government. And, you know, we shouldn't allow it to be treated as such by the government. And their laws don't apply to bitcoin because it's not currency by their own definitions or something.

Car [00:15:39]:
Yeah, we got Lux with the top comment. Lux says if the buyer buys something and the seller refuses to take offered legal tender, the debt is discharged if the contract is not specified differently. Ah, I got zero x. Bitcoin says, this question of being illegal is history. Only deniers don't see it. Yeah. Yeah, I don't really have an opinion on this, to be honest. I don't know why.

Keyan [00:16:04]:
Yeah, well, I guess, you know, people, Darth coin is debunking the myth that bitcoin is illegal because it isn't legal tender.

Car [00:16:14]:
And so he's looks like he's done one already.

Keyan [00:16:17]:
He has done his. Yeah, that was the third one in a series. I think another top in the fifth top story is his second one in the series. So we'll get to that a story or two from now or right now.

Car [00:16:30]:
Yeah, let's just get into it right now because it's already there. So this is the fifth top story is governments will shut down the Internet. So bitcoin is dead. This is from bitcoin. Bitcoin use territory Darth coin 28 comments 2000 case ads so this is the fifth top story. So what did. So he had two top stories.

Keyan [00:16:49]:
That would. That should be the fourth top story.

Car [00:16:50]:
That's the fourth top story.

Keyan [00:16:52]:
There should be constructive criticism versus unconstructive. Do you have that one?

Car [00:16:56]:

Keyan [00:16:57]:
Okay, so this is the, this is the fourth top story. This was supposed to be the fifth, but we'll, we're skipping around.

Car [00:17:04]:
Darth threw us off this week. It's your fault, Darth. So what is this about?

Keyan [00:17:08]:
That's right, Darth. This one's about, you know, so the other, the myth that he's debunking here is that the government will shut down the Internet to shut down bitcoin if it has to. And so bitcoin, you know, if the government doesn't want bitcoin to exist, they won't exist because government will shut down the Internet.

Car [00:17:26]:
I don't think that's why they'll shut down the Internet. But keep going.

Keyan [00:17:29]:
Why will they shut down the Internet?

Car [00:17:30]:
To roll out the CBDC.

Keyan [00:17:32]:
Wait, how would the CBD. Doesn't the CBDC rely on the Internet? No, I'm telling you, they're gonna be using EC.

Car [00:17:40]:
Roll out the CBDC.

Keyan [00:17:42]:
Cloning of some.

Car [00:17:45]:
That's how they roll out the CBDC. Dude, come on, dude, you know who's gonna. Bitcoin.

Keyan [00:17:50]:
I was gonna replace Biden. His clone.

Car [00:17:54]:
Some people think you already have.

Keyan [00:17:56]:
Young Biden. Young Bidenhouse. Cyber Covid. Yeah, that seems like a BDC boost.

Car [00:18:12]:
Dude, they pulled off Covid really well. Like, that worked. You think they can't pull off a cyber pandemic?

Keyan [00:18:18]:

Car [00:18:20]:
I'm gonna be a complete blackout, right? It's not gonna be. This is just will be probably, like the major areas that will be blacked out. Come on, man. It's totally feasible.

Keyan [00:18:30]:
I don't even know what you're saying. You're like, they're going to roll out an Internet currency without the Internet. That's basically what you're saying.

Car [00:18:38]:
Basically mister robot.

Keyan [00:18:41]:
But they had the Internet and mister robot.

Car [00:18:42]:
No, they shut it down. Pretty sure they shut it down. Then they wrote out the bank coin.

Keyan [00:18:47]:
You're, like, writing some fan fiction.

Car [00:18:49]:
I write my fan fiction this weekend. Cool. So what did he come on? What side did he come on with this?

Keyan [00:18:55]:
Well, he just said the government won't shut down the Internet because they rely on the government. The government themselves relies on the Internet. And so that's a big one. And then he talks about a bunch of alternatives to using ISP's, using the parts of the Internet that governments would shut down using mesh networks.

Car [00:19:19]:
Yeah, totally.

Keyan [00:19:20]:
He's like, we'll do. We'll, you know, if we have to, we'll get around it. And they won't do it anyway, so it's not that big of a deal.

Car [00:19:28]:
Yeah, it's good post. Good post. I think that's the. So this is the third top story.

Keyan [00:19:38]:
No, that's the final one because we've already done four. You just skipped. You skipped it to go to Darth. Second post.

Car [00:19:45]:
So we're done with Darth Post today if.

Keyan [00:19:48]:
If that's what you decide. I'm just, I'm just subject. I'm just subject to your rules.

Car [00:19:54]:
He's not, he's not watching this. He doesn't care about this, coop.

Keyan [00:19:57]:
Okay, corp. Uh, do you see his finger? Yeah, you saw that picture of his finger.

Car [00:20:04]:
Hopefully it's doing better.

Keyan [00:20:05]:
Just do a whole podcast about.

Car [00:20:07]:
I mean, that fucking hurts, dude. Sorry, I didn't mean to curse the constructive criticism versus unconstructive criticism of open stats. This is from July 2, bitcoin territory. 23 comments, 3500 sets. Kiln. What's this? I've never heard of this place.

Keyan [00:20:22]:
Oh. Oh, that's weird because you did. You've done podcasts with founder of it and I think you have like a tattoo on your lower back. Whoa. Of both Matt O'Dell and just says O'Dell in like a script font with.

Car [00:20:40]:
That's weird.

Keyan [00:20:41]:
This is where your mind is going to. And a little elf next to it.

Car [00:20:46]:
But it's weird where your mind went.

Keyan [00:20:49]:
I'm sexy, dude. But let's see. I think opensats came out with an announcement that they gave a new round of grants. And people when these grants go out, they get upset that they weren't a recipient during this round or previous rounds. And they feel like it's a little bit of an oligopoly and the money is being.

Car [00:21:16]:

Keyan [00:21:17]:
So they just, they just kept away from them.

Car [00:21:19]:
Added all this. Everybody just went off on them or something or what?

Keyan [00:21:22]:
Yeah. And so I guess that's what Capford is responding to. I didn't really see. I didn't really see much.

Car [00:21:26]:
You kind of see it on Noster more than you do on Stacker news. I don't think Stacker news.

Keyan [00:21:30]:
No, I don't. Well, I don't think anyone, anyone who is paying attention to either, anyone who's associated with open sets, they're all on Noster. And so I think if you want to attack them, that's where you have to go. But apparently the backlash is pretty big. You see this when spiral gives out grants to. The same thing happens and. Yeah, and I think it's not. It's not very.

Keyan [00:21:57]:
They're not really telling people, telling open sats how to fix it. They're mostly just complaining and saying. They're like, they're corrupt and whatever. So that's what, that's what cut for it is.

Car [00:22:08]:
I think that. I think the biggest thing here is, like, when I think about it, like, I know too many people on that board to, like, really talk about it publicly, if that makes any sense.

Keyan [00:22:20]:

Car [00:22:21]:
I'd rather just go directly to those people and tell them, you know, any feedback. And I hate the word criticism because it's, like, the dumbest word to use in this scenario. It's more like feedback. Like, constructive feedback is a much more appropriate word for something like this because it's, whenever you're doing, like, a community type of thing, it's ever evolving and it's ever changing because of the people in it. So you have to be a little bit more constructive about your. About the feedback that you give. And it has to be direct to the people. It can't just be an anonymous post just online, you know, that's just, to me, that's just very cowardly way of doing it.

Car [00:22:57]:
But, yeah, I think constructive feedback is good. I mean, you run Snacker news, you get constructive feedback. I run club lab. I get constructive feedback all the time. Sometimes criticisms, too, and you just try to fix and you learn along the way, and that's all you really can do. Whenever you're doing something with that's community kind of focused like that. And that's. Yeah, my heart goes out to them because I don't know if I could take the beating like that publicly, the way they are.

Car [00:23:21]:
But I do know that people like Nifty's on the board, right? I mean, Ben know Ben really well, Matt. So it's kind of hard, like, you know, so it's just kind of one of those things where you kind of just have to give your feedback directly to them and then. Yeah, but I would say their heart's in the right place. They're doing the right thing. I mean, dude, we sent a lot of people to opensats. Like a lot of the top builders that were looking for funding, we sent their, I don't know if they got funded or not, but we sending them there, we send them to the HRF. And I think it's important to have like the developer ecosystem taken care of as well as the noster ecosystem taken care of. And here I'm going to show plebbook real quick.

Car [00:24:07]:
But if you go to, don't go to playbook. We have this whole thing here where grants and donations and stuff like that. They're not the only people that are doing it. There's like Bitmax is doing it too. You got brinks doing it. Chain co labs, Gemini opportunity fund, human rights. Yeah, the open sats. Ok, coin.

Keyan [00:24:28]:
You control more than just open.

Car [00:24:29]:
Yeah, you can. Yeah, there's spiral, there's venti. Like, there's a lot more than just them. But I think, you know, it's important to give, like all these people are focused on the bitcoin developers and the nostril developers in the ecosystem and it's important that there's just another player. And I think Jack is the one that gave them. That's public, right?

Keyan [00:24:48]:

Car [00:24:49]:
Okay, cool.

Keyan [00:24:49]:
He gave them like, I think he gave them like 5 million or 10 million to star. And then he gave them more recently another like 1015.

Car [00:24:56]:
I mean they're like, I mean they're, they're doing the best they can. So that's my, that's my two cent on it. Cool.

Keyan [00:25:07]:
Yeah. Having a bunch of money and figuring out what to do with it is hard.

Car [00:25:10]:
More money, more problems.

Keyan [00:25:11]:
You have to sympathize with that real thing.

Car [00:25:13]:
More money, more problems. That's notorious b I g here.

Keyan [00:25:18]:
Here is what the cool.

Car [00:25:23]:
Next tops. No, that's it. That's all the top stories of the week.

Keyan [00:25:26]:

Car [00:25:27]:
Now we're gonna get into my favorite part of the show, key on top.

Keyan [00:25:32]:
You have a favorite part of the show?

Car [00:25:33]:
Keyon's top picks this week?

Keyan [00:25:35]:
Oh, well these, this is meta here.

Car [00:25:37]:
Oh, okay. So hang on.

Keyan [00:25:38]:
We're all over the place this week.

Car [00:25:39]:
We're all over the place this weekend. Darth threw us off.

Keyan [00:25:42]:
Oh, except the cowboy part. Oh, unless he is like being sneaky.

Car [00:25:48]:
So your top post was an interview with Ek from Flip poet from pleb.

Keyan [00:25:52]:
Poet. Do you want to talk about what you want to talk about your thing with?

Car [00:25:57]:
Yeah, if you want to. I thought this was a really interesting post because. Yeah, okay. Because it was, it was one of those things where when, when I, when I saw it, I was like, I can hear y'all talking.

PlebPoet [00:26:14]:

Car [00:26:15]:

PlebPoet [00:26:16]:
That's what I'm hoping for. Like, whenever you read any of these interview things that I'm doing, it's like, not trying to, like, write paragraphs. I'm just trying. And I'm also, when me and Ek, like, decided, like, sit down, I did not have any questions prepared. So, like, this is supposed to feel organic conversation style.

Car [00:26:36]:
It was interesting. There was one where he said, do you think Jack Dorsey is on snack or news?

PlebPoet [00:26:40]:

Car [00:26:40]:
He said no. Like, he, like, he kind of knew.

PlebPoet [00:26:43]:
I know. That's why I asked. I was like, are you sure?

Car [00:26:46]:
And then he goes. And you said, confirm. And then he goes. And then he said he thinks it's because he's too busy.

PlebPoet [00:26:51]:
And which I could hear Keon saying this.

Car [00:26:54]:
I will say this. He has responded to a noster note on mine where I literally, right underneath that I put a stacker news link. So I think he does know it.

PlebPoet [00:27:05]:
He's aware.

Car [00:27:06]:
I think he does know it exists.

PlebPoet [00:27:07]:
I'm gonna get to the place where I get to interview Jack Dorsey like this someday. Jack, if you're watching, speaking it into the world.

Car [00:27:15]:
But, yeah, I thought that was a good one. And then this one surprised me. You said, what's something that never gets talked about on Stacker news that you wish would? That's a good question. And he says it's like the surprise. Interesting. Doesn't have to be controversial, but usually is the outliers.

PlebPoet [00:27:28]:

Car [00:27:29]:
What did you think about this question? He said, cube and the stackers. What do you think about that?

PlebPoet [00:27:33]:
Okay. Yeah. So this, I think the result that you get here in this post is after, like, taking what Ek says to me and writing notes about it and then thinking about it for a week and then coming back to it. And, like, Ek already speaks a different language. And so we're kind of, like, mashing those, like, ideas together. So maybe it didn't come out like that great of a, like, smoothen transition of what we were talking about. But he was just pointing to the fact that, like, if you just appeared on Stacker News and you saw that Kub was the creator, but he's also, like a big stacker, you'd be like, hmm, that's weird. But really? It's just that he posts great stuff.

Car [00:28:12]:
Yeah, I remember when he used to post terrible things. See, in the early days.

PlebPoet [00:28:16]:
Me too. I was just looking at that.

Car [00:28:19]:
I try not to zap them very often.

PlebPoet [00:28:21]:

Car [00:28:22]:
But when I do, it's usually because it's like a really good post.

PlebPoet [00:28:24]:
Exactly. It's a righteous Zapdeh zap.

Car [00:28:26]:
Yeah. It's more righteous. But there's some stackers out there that just will, like, you know, zap.

PlebPoet [00:28:30]:
And that's okay. And that's.

Car [00:28:32]:
That's not okay, but it's.

PlebPoet [00:28:33]:
It's needed in the stacker news space. It's gonna happen. There's gonna be fanatics.

Car [00:28:37]:
He's the fiat java of Snacker news.

PlebPoet [00:28:39]:

Car [00:28:39]:
That's what it is.

PlebPoet [00:28:40]:
And that's fine.

Car [00:28:41]:
Just like, congratulations, Cube is the nostril. No, this is good.

PlebPoet [00:28:46]:
Okay. Yeah. I'm thinking about who I'm gonna interview next, but.

Car [00:28:50]:
Yeah. Who are you interviewing next?

PlebPoet [00:28:52]:
I'm thinking about one of the mutiny boys.

Car [00:28:54]:
Oh. You know who I would really like to see you interview? Janet Yellen.

PlebPoet [00:28:59]:

Car [00:29:00]:
That would be interesting. Yeah. Janet Yellen. Cuz. Yes. She has a lot of hot topics. Hot answers.

PlebPoet [00:29:07]:
Has she been around lately?

Car [00:29:10]:
She lurk.

PlebPoet [00:29:11]:

Car [00:29:12]:

PlebPoet [00:29:12]:
Lurking. Okay.

Car [00:29:14]:
Other. I think undisciplined would be good. And I don't. I don't probably wouldn't do it, but Darth coin would be interesting.

PlebPoet [00:29:20]:
That would be great. Yeah.

Car [00:29:22]:
Or undisciplined. Or Natalia, I think, would be another.

PlebPoet [00:29:25]:
But I do love to do these.

Car [00:29:26]:
Ziggy. I mean, basically all.

PlebPoet [00:29:28]:
Do you love to do these in person.

Car [00:29:29]:
So if it ever happened.

PlebPoet [00:29:31]:
Happens that we're in the same place, which I will be in Nashville.

Car [00:29:34]:
So there you go.

PlebPoet [00:29:35]:
Stackers reach out, I guess.

Car [00:29:37]:
Yeah. You should do. You should totally do some in Nashville.

Keyan [00:29:42]:

PlebPoet [00:29:42]:
We'll see how it goes. I'll be there.

Car [00:29:44]:

PlebPoet [00:29:45]:
All right.

Car [00:29:45]:
Thank you for coming on the show.

PlebPoet [00:29:47]:
Hell, yeah.

Car [00:29:49]:
Kian, what did you think of this post? This is one of your favorite posts this week.

Keyan [00:29:55]:
Yeah, it was cool. It was nice hearing about it. Okay. I normally don't. I don't let him talk when we have together, but I give him. No, I'm just kidding. You know, it's just cool to hear how he. Confirming that Ek is at a different person with me than he is with other people is nice.

Keyan [00:30:16]:
So he's the same person and.

Car [00:30:20]:

Keyan [00:30:20]:
Yeah, that was. I liked it. I like Ek.

Car [00:30:23]:
Yeah. Good post. Your other post was made. Your 2024 customer data breaches so far. What's this.

Keyan [00:30:31]:
This is a post from scores b, where he summarized all the data. I was surprised I didn't. I mean, I had been seeing these data breaches, but I hadn't really, like, totaled them up.

Car [00:30:42]:
That's big, dude.

Keyan [00:30:43]:
Yeah, that was the earliest one.

Car [00:30:45]:
Everybody uses that for, like, they're bought by salesforce. Yeah.

Keyan [00:30:49]:
Yeah. I mean, they, like.

Car [00:30:51]:
It's like somebody's trying to do a cyber pandemic.

Keyan [00:30:56]:
First they have to shut off the Internet. Right, car.

Car [00:30:58]:
Well, first you get access to Trilio. There's a lot of servers that. Yeah, this is smart. And at amp T and L, whom. Coincidence. It writes itself.

Keyan [00:31:13]:
Sound effects. Yeah.

Car [00:31:15]:
This is amazing.

Keyan [00:31:16]:
Yeah. It's a great summary. And you can click and view them all, but that's like, you know, that's like two times the american population. Most of us have probably been, you know, had our data leaked more than once within the year already, which is crazy.

Car [00:31:31]:
Golly. We had. Who was the top comment? 21 e. Six says, add Philippines. Jollibee Food Corporation, 11 million customers.

Keyan [00:31:41]:
Yeah, I can't. I mean, this probably happens all the time, all over the world. These are just kind of the ones that break in the United States.

Car [00:31:48]:
Club poet said, add Ticketmaster to the list. Apparently. Ticketmaster, too.

Keyan [00:31:53]:
Yeah, but they were using Snowflake.

Car [00:31:54]:
Oh, wow.

Keyan [00:31:55]:
That's. The thing is, like, there's. It's like a russian doll thing of data. And one of the russian dolls gets breached.

Car [00:32:05]:
And once you see it, you can't see it. They're positioning for the cyber pandemic. This makes sense. Um, the. We're gonna jump into my top stories of the week. The first one was, brace yourselves, Mount Gox distributions. What do you think about this? Did you see this?

Keyan [00:32:21]:
I don't care.

Car [00:32:22]:
It's just the price is falling.

Keyan [00:32:25]:
Yay. I don't know. Six once bitcoins at $10,000. Then I'll be.

Car [00:32:31]:
See the memes. Now the bitcoin crash memes are coming, too. First times.

Keyan [00:32:36]:
This hat. Doesn't this happen all the time?

Car [00:32:39]:
Yeah. Every cycle we would get a Mount Gox news item, and then the.

Keyan [00:32:44]:
This, I don't think is a news on this. Actual selling. I think actual dumping.

Car [00:32:48]:
Yeah. Yeah. People will dump and then kick off the bull run. August, all that. It's just the same. It's literally like. Feel like the meridian sometimes where you're just like, in the matrix. You're so.

Car [00:33:00]:
Yep. Seen this?

Keyan [00:33:02]:
Was it the mayor of engine? Is he the one with, like, the.

Car [00:33:04]:
He was the one. He was the one that kind of saw, he saw it all playing out. He's like, oh, yeah, this is gonna happen. That's gonna go in this. I don't count. I don't count the new one, that's not in the canon in my, my book.

Keyan [00:33:16]:
Oh, yeah. Because it's the best one. It stands on its own, separate.

Car [00:33:22]:
It's so I tried watching it again. I told you. Right. Like, I really tried watching, and it just. You can't. No one in their right mind can stomach through that.

Keyan [00:33:29]:
Oh, I must be out of my mind, because I thought it was. I thought it was.

Car [00:33:32]:
Oh, yeah, you liked it.

Keyan [00:33:33]:
But I thought it was okay.

Car [00:33:34]:
Do you like the first matrix, though? Probably not.

Keyan [00:33:37]:

Car [00:33:37]:
You did like the first matrix? Yes. I liked all the second one and the third one.

Keyan [00:33:40]:
I watched all three of them going up to the fourth.

Car [00:33:42]:
How did you like it?

Keyan [00:33:44]:
A lot. And I like actually under. I'd like the second watch through. We really made sure we understood everything that they were talking about. And so we rewatch parts of it and really try to break it down. The fourth one was, I think, as good as a fourth one could be. There was a super meta kind of self aware. I don't.

Keyan [00:34:04]:
The third, I felt like the third one was dumb too.

Car [00:34:07]:
I think the acting was really good and like, you know, look, everything visually looked good. It was just. Terrible story. Anyways.

Keyan [00:34:16]:

Car [00:34:16]:
I don't know how we got off that, but. Yeah. Mount Gox, the other one was. Oh, yeah. So this came out the bitcoin Asia. All roads leads to lightning play.

PlebPoet [00:34:26]:
This. Amazing developers on our team all around the world really been working to make this possible.

Keyan [00:34:32]:
I did not watch any bitcoin Asia.

Car [00:34:36]:
No. I'm probably gonna watch it this weekend.

PlebPoet [00:34:37]:
Bitcoin core developers that work on complexities. Right.

Car [00:34:44]:
We're building. I don't know if we'll get a, if we get blocked, probably shouldn't play it. All right. Yeah, check it out. I thought that was interesting. The other one, Santos posted this announcing Zapconf 2024. Boom. He's gonna be doing a virtual conference, which I don't know why more people don't do virtual conferences.

Car [00:35:01]:
It's such an easy lift.

Keyan [00:35:02]:
I think it depends on the person throwing it, but I think some of them, I think they're harder to do well. I think that's the main reason.

Car [00:35:11]:
Yeah. I think it's probably just the organizing, but I think there's definitely. There's definitely an avenue for virtual conferences, I think, part.

Keyan [00:35:18]:
Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I haven't I don't think I've attended one, but check it out.

Car [00:35:23]:
Stackers. If you're interested. Check out Zapconf. It'll be in September. I think he's gonna do a hackathon. He's looking for sponsors. Yeah, reach out. The other one was artificial intelligence.

Car [00:35:37]:
Did you see the debates on the stuff that I was dropping this weekend?

Keyan [00:35:41]:
No, I didn't date.

Car [00:35:42]:
It was some really good back and forth talk on the whole AI stuff. I don't know. I feel like there's this kind of. So there's kind of two. There's like two qualms about this when it comes to AI. There's like the qualm about, oh, we're not going to get to AGI by 2028. There's that qualm and then there's the qualm that AI actually doesn't do anything. It's just, how do you say, like regurgitating.

Car [00:36:09]:
Already copied. That's the word I'm looking for.

Keyan [00:36:13]:
Yeah. You have two completely opposite takes on it, which I think suggests that people are. People don't know what the future of it is. Well, at least one side really doesn't know what the future of it is. But I. Most people are out of their depth, I think, too, when they're trying to understand it.

Car [00:36:40]:
Yeah. So there is just a ton of debates kind of going on. I think it's still kind of going on. I think the original, like right here. I'll read the top part because I think this kind of summarizes it pretty well. Early a. Early AI pioneers were optimistic. In 1965, Herbert Simon predicted in his book the Shape of Automation for men and management that machines will be capable within 20 years of doing any work that a man can do.

Car [00:37:02]:
This was in the. And then in 1970, Life magazine Marvin Minsky quoted as declaring that in the next three to eight years, we will have machine with general intelligence of an average human being. This was in the seventies, so if you fast forward now, it still kind of remained unclear until here recently, but AGI seems like the primary goal for all this. And so you have AI doomers declaring that the existential threat from AGI is their number one fear. I think Elon's a part of that Darth coin here on Snucker news as a part of that.

Keyan [00:37:35]:
I don't think he believes in AGI. No.

Car [00:37:38]:
I think he's the whole doomerism around AI.

Keyan [00:37:40]:
He's definitely a doomer.

Car [00:37:41]:
Yeah. So many AI practitioners have speculated on the timeline to AGI. One predicting for example, a 50% chance that it have AGI by 2028. So it kind of goes back to the whole other thing. But when I look at this, and I've been reading more, I've been watching more, been like listening more about AI and all this kind of stuff. Want to get your feedback on this. I tend to think that it's going to be a similar kind of shift we'll see, and it won't happen right away, but it'll be a similar shift that we kind of saw from like analog recording in music to digital recording in music. And just want to point out one thing with that is that took a long period of time for the whole ecosystem, production suite, plugins, even the equipment itself, to get to be digital.

Car [00:38:33]:
Right. That took a really, that took like over a decade plus. Right. And then you had. So that's part of it. Then you had the Napster part of it, which was the peer to peer decentralized system. So that's another layer on top of you're already going from analog to digital. Doesn't mean that that couldn't have happened without it.

Car [00:38:50]:
It just meant that it was just far easier to make that happen than the ipod, and then the rest is history after that. I kind of think it's kind of similar. The only difference this time is that there's technologists that are used to working directly with computers, and that's going to be abstracted away from them, in a sense. Right. And then there's this. For me, when I look at it, me and Uncle Jim were talking about this, but there's this whole gray area that if by the time we get to 2028, if it actually does hit AGI hits in 2028, you have this gray area because you have this peer to peer, machine to machine payment prospect to it now with bitcoin, and then a lot of this will be a little bit, I think I said in second news, but I think it'd be kind of commoditized. Based on the type of reading I'm seeing out there, it seems like a lot of it's going to be easier to produce, easier to create all that kind of same thing that we saw with the digital stuff. Like, once the digital thing happened, everybody in their bedroom became a bedroom producer.

Car [00:39:55]:
Right. It's like overnight I did, yeah. I mean, it just naturally happened. The opportunity to then go and record things, you didn't necessarily needed a studio anymore. But I think what ended up happening, what we ended up seeing happen, was there's kind of merge between the analog and digital, and you kind of saw those and that's where the equilibrium was eventually. Anyway, just want your thoughts on that. What do you think about that?

Keyan [00:40:19]:
About what you said, like if you had.

Car [00:40:21]:
Yeah, I just want your thoughts.

Keyan [00:40:22]:
I don't think you had a point. I could.

Car [00:40:24]:
I don't really have a point.

Keyan [00:40:25]:
I could.

Car [00:40:25]:
I just think it's interesting that this kind of conversation bounce off as at least it's moving in a direction. I don't know. Do you sit on anywhere on this, any other stuff?

Keyan [00:40:35]:
I mean, I think the only thing I think that I might say is that the one unique thing about AI that's unlike many of these other transitions and technology is that you can use AI to make AI. And so I think that doesn't exist at the same level. That degree of self reference and self feedback does not exist in other things. I think this will be the strongest self feedback that we ever experienced. And so that's why I think, and while Marvin Minsky was wrong and that so many of those predictions are wrong, it doesn't say it's going to be slower, it's going to be that slower. We're going to be that wrong now. I think we could make better predictions now given the position that we're in and we are closer. I think they would be very happy with where we are now.

Keyan [00:41:45]:
They might even be suggesting they might have been mostly trying to predict the degree to which we have AI now. Yeah, I don't. So I don't know.

Car [00:41:55]:
I mean, that's a. I mean, it sounds like you have an opinion on it, which is what I was looking for. Interesting. Okay.

Keyan [00:42:01]:
I don't know. I thought the guy who used to work for OpenAI safety board that you shared his essay or his series of essays, articles or whatever that he's been writing, watched a podcast with him and.

Car [00:42:15]:
He'S check that out.

Keyan [00:42:17]:
He's pretty convinced that they said they're already building, I think, $500 billion or. No, it's $50 billion data centers. And some of these companies are already looking to acquire power, kind of like what bitcoin miners do. And he said, eventually we'll have trillion dollar data centers where these companies are willing to spend a trillion dollars just to train AI on it. And he has, you know, he's thought about it very far out, like where this becomes like, relevant at a national security level and it is very preoccupied with, like, defending our AI intellectual property.

Car [00:43:13]:
Well, yeah, I mean, I shared the other post. There was one with Sama that he did an interview with the guy, your favorite person from Airbnb. And he had, he had their, their tam. He had their tam as the world's gdp. That's what he put inside their deck. And I was just like blown away. I was like, what? So they're buying it?

Keyan [00:43:41]:
Yeah. I mean, a lot of what's really, what's, what occurred to me is you have, you have Apple, you have Google, specifically, Apple and Google have been sitting on like hundreds of billions of dollars in their treasury in cash with nothing to do with it. And this lines up perfectly with things that are consistent about their beliefs and everything. And so you can imagine them finally deploying that toward. Toward something or toward AI. And so that's like another thing that's kind of bullish in favor of AI getting better rather fast is because a bunch of the people who've been making all the money more recently haven't really found a mission that they wanted to spend it on. And here it is.

Car [00:44:41]:
Think it's bullish for bitcoin, machine to machine payments?

Keyan [00:44:44]:
I don't even think we have human to human payments yet in bitcoin working very well.

Car [00:44:50]:
Would it be easier, though?

Keyan [00:44:53]:
No, no, no, I don't think so. I mean, automating something is, I think, harder than doing it manually. Just like I can't, I still can't vacuum my.

Car [00:45:05]:
Do you think they'll get.

Keyan [00:45:06]:
Well, maybe I could if.

Car [00:45:07]:
I think they'll get to AGI faster than we'll get to better machine to machine payments.

Keyan [00:45:16]:
I don't know. I don't really know yet. But I would guess the people who, most of the people who are making AI, I'm not sure they're really, I'm not sure they're all that concerned with good money. I don't know really see them as bitcoiners so much. I do think it is somewhat at opposite ends with a lot of the people in AI. Bitcoin is so I can imagine them more so using a CBDC or something else like that, especially in a situation where this does become relevant to national security. I don't. But I don't know.

Keyan [00:46:03]:
I don't know. But again, we don't even have, we don't even have good human to human payments yet with bitcoin.

Car [00:46:08]:
It's still too early. But yeah, see, you had some stuff in you. The other one I want to bring up was this other post was, why did Russia invade Ukraine? So Kefir dropped this this week right before July 4. And stackers thinks it's because they fear NATO expansion.

Keyan [00:46:29]:
Oh, right. Yeah. Why did that. Why did the war happen three years ago? Yeah. There's a lot of perspectives out there on this.

Car [00:46:37]:
And, dude, it's crazy to see the sackers so political.

Keyan [00:46:42]:
Yeah, this is very divisive politically. The left largely considers it. Putin is kind of a maniac, and I an imperialist.

Car [00:46:55]:
These comments never end.

Keyan [00:46:57]:
And then. And then people who are more on the right side of the right wing side of things feel that we were encroaching on, like, sacred ground, and that's why Putin attacked. I don't know what's right, because, you know, there's. Truth is, like, hard to find, I think, you know. Yeah.

Car [00:47:26]:
Darth coin with the top comment. It says it's all globalist game. All wars or bankster wars. What do you think about that?

Keyan [00:47:33]:
I mean, there's certainly someone getting there, several people getting rich off this war, and I would. Banks are.

Car [00:47:41]:

Keyan [00:47:42]:
Part of it.

Car [00:47:42]:
It's interesting. We got technical stuff, lot of political stuff. 4 July. I don't know if I saw that many 4 July posts. Second is this week, but.

Keyan [00:47:51]:
Oh, I don't think so. I don't think we did. We didn't do our. We last year. We did fireworks, and I forgot this year. Big mistake. Big mistake.

Car [00:48:04]:
We're gonna jump into meta. Those are all my top posts of the week. This is meta. Why don't stackers donate to rewards anymore? What are rewards?

Keyan [00:48:13]:
What, our rewards?

Car [00:48:14]:

Keyan [00:48:15]:
Yeah. They're at the bottom there. If you go.

Car [00:48:17]:
Probably why. There you go.

Keyan [00:48:18]:
Oh, this is a really long throw. Okay. Yeah.

Car [00:48:22]:
Oh, whoa. Well, yeah, that's why it's at the bottom.

Keyan [00:48:25]:
Yeah. And I don't. Jana's calling out the devil. Yeah, the devil's amount.

Car [00:48:35]:
So what does this mean, though? What does this mean? So you donated. So you donate, and then what happens?

Keyan [00:48:41]:
You donate, and then it gets distributed to other stackers at the end of the day.

Car [00:48:49]:

Keyan [00:48:50]:
You don't rise on the leaderboard from donating.

Car [00:48:51]:
You rise in the leaderboard from donating. I'm gonna try it next week. So you found a cheat code on stack your names. Wow.

Keyan [00:48:58]:
It's not. I mean, did you.

Car [00:49:00]:
Are you.

Keyan [00:49:00]:
Cheat codes.

Car [00:49:01]:
Are you fixing those cheat codes?

Keyan [00:49:03]:
No, I'm not fixing any. I'm working on the wallets. That's mostly what I'm doing. I'm gonna. I'm working on referrals.

Car [00:49:10]:
So the whole post was about, here, let me go back. So the post was about, why don't people donate?

Keyan [00:49:15]:
Yeah. What happened to people donating? To rewards. That's what.

Car [00:49:19]:
Hey, Ruby said that.

Keyan [00:49:20]:

Car [00:49:20]:
I didn't even know that was a thing.

Keyan [00:49:22]:
Yes. If someone has some stats that they would like to give to the best stackers.

Car [00:49:27]:
21 I didn't even know was a thing.

Keyan [00:49:29]:
Yeah, you got to be paying attention. But yeah, we don't. It's not. It's at the bottom and, you know, it has a big donate button on the rewards page. But maybe we could do better about that. But this should let people know they can.

Car [00:49:49]:
The other meta was sn bitcoin classroom. This is from I am single. Bitcoin territory, 33 commonsense, 1600 cent. What's this?

Keyan [00:50:01]:
Yeah, I am single. Once he thinks that we should have like a group learning period of time and. Yeah. And then a bunch of people talked about it. I don't. I mean, I think that if he has questions, you should just ask them as a post. That's what I, I like.

Car [00:50:26]:
What would be this between an ama, though?

Keyan [00:50:29]:
He wants it to be recurring and be like kind of like a genius bar online, you know, 1 hour a week or a month or something. I don't know.

Car [00:50:43]:
I would just, I would just tell them, start it, start it next. Just pick a date, pick a time, tag people, and then see who shows up.

Keyan [00:50:53]:
That's, I mean, that's how I would roll. If this is, if this is something that really needs to happen, I think it'll come together that will do it.

Car [00:50:59]:
And then see if people show up and.

Keyan [00:51:01]:
But expect it. I think people tag this guy.

Car [00:51:03]:
He's on there all the time. Tag ek. He'll answer questions.

Keyan [00:51:06]:
Yeah, I'll try to answer. I can google pretty well things that I've.

Car [00:51:11]:
Answer questions. Tag pleb poetry. Answer questions. Tag the people. Yeah. More technical questions for you. Okay. Yeah, there you go.

Car [00:51:23]:
Made it happen.

Keyan [00:51:24]:
What's the devil's favorite number?

Car [00:51:27]:
The next, the next one was we do it because it's hard. This is John F. Kennedy. I mean, coop post.

Keyan [00:51:33]:
I was going to, I was going to like, rewrite his speech. Like, that's so, like fucking.

Car [00:51:39]:
We're doing. We go to the Mohardy because it's hard, not because we need. What do you say?

Keyan [00:51:45]:
Uh, we go to the moon. Not because it's easy, but because it's hard. And that's works.

Car [00:51:51]:
Plus, I love that. That's one of my favorite speeches.

Keyan [00:51:55]:
It's a great speech. You gave a lot of great speeches.

Car [00:51:57]:
My favorite speeches. That one. And the, um, the, the one with the, uh, the man in the ring. Do you know that one.

Keyan [00:52:07]:
The man in the arena.

Car [00:52:08]:
Man arena, yeah. That's another one. Yeah.

Keyan [00:52:12]:
Yeah. That was a time, I think, when speeches really mattered, when it wasn't all about, like, the aesthetics.

Car [00:52:20]:
Now we have, like, yeah, crazy looking communistic speeches.

Keyan [00:52:26]:
Seems clonianistic cloning. What's this? This is my. Oh, so we were redoing the wallets. This is what I've been working on. I was working on this for two years, for about a month, which is, I had to rewrite all of our. All. Everything that did payments, basically, all the things that did payments. And that's what I did.

Keyan [00:52:52]:
And this was that release. And it's actually not very glamorous because most people aren't even going to notice. But it's all in pursuit of what I think of as an ideal non custodial wallet.

Car [00:53:11]:
So wallets are fixed, then, is what you're saying.

Keyan [00:53:14]:
Eventually there will be. They're not now.

Car [00:53:16]:
So this is like, what are we doing next here?

Keyan [00:53:19]:
Are you going to go next is non custodial zapping.

Car [00:53:24]:
So that's what you're working on now?

Keyan [00:53:25]:
I'm working on referrals right now, but, yeah, as far as the wallet, I'm going to work on the non custodial zapping next, taking a little detour.

Car [00:53:33]:
Okay, so non custodial zapping. And then after that, fix everything else after that.

Keyan [00:53:41]:
It's mostly make it really nice to add non custodial wallets. And then the wallet plans are pretty much done at that point. You'll. We won't be custodial anymore, is the plan shut off custodianship?

Car [00:54:01]:
So you'll shut it off after, you'll give, like, a date?

Keyan [00:54:05]:
Yes. Well, all the funds. All the funds will still be available to withdraw, like, regardless of when we go non custodial, all of your custodial bitcoin will be withdrawable as bitcoin, but we won't allow you to add more bitcoin to it or send it to someone else, to ojustackers.

Car [00:54:20]:
Who's gonna close the gates? I said this a year ago, said, koob is gonna close the gates once the bull run starts. This is what you're doing, some preparation of it.

Keyan [00:54:30]:
Okay. Yeah. I don't view it that way, but, yeah, we're gonna give it a shot.

Car [00:54:34]:
You're closing the gates.

Keyan [00:54:36]:
The only other thing I see people doing in the ecosystem, other than trying to make a decent non custodial experience, is staying custodial but kycing.

Car [00:54:49]:
Oh, so you're saying you just don't want to do the KyC stuff.

Keyan [00:54:53]:
We'Ll probably end up having to offer it as an option to people that don't mind being KyC.

Car [00:55:02]:
So you're going to have the. So you're going to go full non custodial, and then after that, give a deadline, and then say, here's the KyC line, if you want to jump on KYC AMl.

Keyan [00:55:15]:
Yeah, that'll come later. If we can find some. A partner that makes sense for helping us do that. Someone who has paid the millions of dollars that it costs to get licensed.

Car [00:55:25]:
There's only two of them just strike in Zebedee at this point, right?

Keyan [00:55:28]:

Car [00:55:29]:
So there's only two of them.

Keyan [00:55:30]:
Yeah, we would. We might. We might offer both, frankly, as. As options. Maybe one person likes the KYC, likes to be KYC'd with one of them and not the other.

Car [00:55:43]:
If you're striker's deputy, submit your bids.

Keyan [00:55:46]:
I don't think it's more like. It's more like they're like, can't. Will they accept me? It's very. It's a very permission situation.

Car [00:55:53]:
Looking for a Stacker news live sponsorship in Nashville, so.

Keyan [00:55:57]:
Also looking for a new host, someone who.

Car [00:56:01]:
Yeah, somebody replaced cooperative.

Keyan [00:56:03]:
Oh, shit.

Car [00:56:05]:
Super test net. If you're out there. Phone. Hope.

Keyan [00:56:07]:
He'd be so much better than me.

Car [00:56:08]:
Yeah, he'll be really good.

Keyan [00:56:10]:
Oh, sing at the end.

Car [00:56:13]:
I think that's it, right? Or do you have anything else you want to see on this?

Keyan [00:56:17]:
Uh, no, that's it. It's boring.

Car [00:56:20]:
Cool. Let's jump into the tamp. Superstar of the weekend. This is the top snaggers of the week. Got somebody in hiding. Undisciplined, dude. Undisciplined is killing it.

Keyan [00:56:34]:
Yeah, look at that.

Car [00:56:35]:
I think. I think I zap his. His everyday stack of this day in history. I zap that every day.

Keyan [00:56:43]:

Car [00:56:43]:
I love that.

Keyan [00:56:45]:

Car [00:56:45]:
I wish he would throw, like, the top stories in there, too.

Keyan [00:56:48]:
You mean more of them?

Car [00:56:50]:

Keyan [00:56:51]:
Cause he has three.

Car [00:56:52]:
I know he has a lot on his plate, so don't worry about it.

Keyan [00:56:53]:
But he has three top stories on it, one from each year for that day. And he has a top comet, and he's the top territory in the top stacker. Okay.

Car [00:57:02]:
But, yeah, keep doing it. I love that. And then you are. Sync, Gray. Ruby Bell, curve Ek. Oh, ek's back.

Keyan [00:57:08]:
Yeah. Look at all you can tell.

Car [00:57:10]:
See, wallets are finished, so you came back.

Keyan [00:57:12]:
They're not backward.

Car [00:57:13]:
Coins report zero x. Bitcoin or Tom K. Yeah. Darth coin we can go into the most boring segment, bitcoin, the Cowboys segment. I don't know why we still do this, Kube. Because future and discipline. One seven.

Keyan [00:57:27]:
David W. David W. Yeah. He's bang. Yeah, I guess so.

Car [00:57:33]:
Watching boot.

Keyan [00:57:34]:
Wait, 80 posts. This is for the week. Oh, no. This is like all time.

Car [00:57:37]:
That's cowboys.

Keyan [00:57:39]:
Yeah, because I was. Because I don't. I haven't seen David W. Around, but he's maintaining his cowboy hat, which is pretty cool. That means you get. I could attack him in something and snare him. Snare him into a conversation, pick his brain if I need to.

Car [00:57:55]:
And then we get million set madness. I still count that, even though it doesn't exist anymore. Leaderboard. Yeah.

Keyan [00:58:07]:
Yeah. Roughly following the value rankings. I wonder if we should randomize it or something. I don't know. I'm thinking about stuff. Stuff. But, yeah, this will be. This will be who gets rewarded today.

Keyan [00:58:20]:
And you can donate to this with that big yellow button under the pie chart. You can give some sense to it. If you're satanic, you can do sixes.

Car [00:58:34]:

Keyan [00:58:36]:
Yeah. Apparently, if you want to beat people on the leaderboard, which is not advisable because I know how it works and it's not. It doesn't do that.

Car [00:58:43]:
But I'm watching the show. Hey, Vic, we got Rennie says hello.

Keyan [00:58:50]:
Oh, malice. Ten malice. Ten posts. A lot of great photos from Venezuela.

Car [00:58:56]:
That's what he said, or she said and then vague said. Matrix films get progressively worse as they go. Thank you. First, amazing question.

Keyan [00:59:05]:
I agree.

Car [00:59:06]:
Second, very good. Third, mediocre. Fourth, awful. Told you.

Keyan [00:59:09]:
I just feel like it wasn't. It was. It was on trend. It was. It's. It what? I didn't hate it. I feel like it's trendy to hate it. I don't want to hate it just because everyone's got to deal with.

Keyan [00:59:19]:
Everyone's, uh, enjoying patting each other on.

Car [00:59:22]:
The back for hating. Actually sent us a zap on fountain saying that he or she got kicked off their couch and they need a place to live and they pick your place. Oh, yours or my place? I said neither. I said, come to plug lap and we can figure it out. So if you're really serious, fake.

Keyan [00:59:45]:
We have a couch at Publa.

Car [00:59:46]:
Have a place to go. We have good restrooms and showers here.

Keyan [00:59:50]:
I don't know about good restrooms, but.

Car [00:59:52]:
The one upstairs is really good. Have you been to the third floor?

Keyan [00:59:55]:
Yeah. That's my secret bath dude.

Car [00:59:57]:
What do you call it? Even though we had that, he was like, is that where he goes like, yes. Dude, why would I go down here in the trash restroom anyways? Oh, yeah, because you are women. That's why.

Keyan [01:00:11]:
Women are gross. But for some reason they keep the bathroom nice. Here, here.

Car [01:00:17]:
We got stack of news live on zap stream. Where is it at? Napstream is just so confusing as far as to get everywhere. There we go. Whoa. Undispluned says, I'm game, pleb poet. If you're ever in the same place. There you go. 117 says, tell David W.

Car [01:00:44]:
That charts is back.

Keyan [01:00:47]:
Oh, right. Yeah, 117. They resurrected the charts territory. It's now charts and numbers. Yeah, and yeah, because previously KR was in charge of it.

Car [01:01:02]:
It's app stream rip. Cool. Keon, what are you doing this weekend?

Keyan [01:01:09]:
I am.

Car [01:01:11]:
Oh, how is the Tokyo. No, you said that you went to like a weird.

Keyan [01:01:15]:
Oh, that's right. I went to a Japanese.

Car [01:01:16]:
How was that?

Keyan [01:01:17]:
It's like the. Where they, like, they paint with wood blocks. I forget what it's called. I wish I knew. I don't. I don't know. I don't remember.

Car [01:01:27]:
They paint with wood plugs.

Keyan [01:01:28]:
Yeah, it's like, it's, you know, like a lot of the japanese art that most people would recognize as japanese art is this type of art where they like, carve something into a wood block, put some, you know, ink or, or paint sonnet and press it into a piece of paper. And there was like kind of sort of mass produced art, but still, you know, today valued as art because it wasn't as, you know, as mass produced anyway, but that. They had an exhibit at Ut. What's the. What's the. Do you know the museum there? What's the museum at Ut? Blanton. I was gonna say Bampton. The Blanton had an exhibit.

Keyan [01:02:16]:
This was the last day we went and checked it out. It was great. Yeah, lots of great stuff.

Car [01:02:21]:
What are you doing this weekend?

Keyan [01:02:23]:
This weekend? Nothing that just work. Nothing like that work on Saturday stuff. That's what I do. It's who I am. What are you doing this weekend?

Car [01:02:34]:
What do we got this weekend? Is it the friend thing that we have or is that next week? That's next week, right?

Keyan [01:02:38]:
If we have the same friend.

Car [01:02:40]:
Yeah, we have the same friend. So. So that's next week. This weekend. What am I doing this weekend? I think we're gonna be filming some stuff. Maybe, maybe not. Just depends and then I. What else? Yeah, probably just that work.

Car [01:02:56]:
Have a very boring life, coop.

Keyan [01:02:59]:
I do.

Car [01:03:00]:

Keyan [01:03:01]:
No, I don't. I don't know, you might have a fun life. I don't think about life as boring or fun.

Car [01:03:07]:
I don't think when I think, when I say that, I mean, like, other people would see it and say, oh, it's boring, but, oh, I have fun doing it.

Keyan [01:03:13]:
Yeah, that's, that's the important part. I don't think any, I don't think those people deserve to say anything. They could shut the heck up.

Car [01:03:23]:

Keyan [01:03:23]:
I mean, their life is probably lame anyway. They're probably, like, empty on the inside. No one, you know, no one loves them.

Car [01:03:31]:
I hope not. It's a sad.

Keyan [01:03:34]:
I don't wish that for them, but that's probably sad what it's like for them.

Car [01:03:39]:
Yeah, I think, I think, I think it's going to be interesting here in July and August and September and bitcoin. I think there's just a lot of. I don't know, it just feels like, like the temperatures are rising as far as, like, ecosystem. It's like everybody's getting ready for the bull run.

Keyan [01:04:02]:

Car [01:04:03]:
Could be just be me.

Keyan [01:04:04]:
I don't know. I'm not really feeling. I don't know what it feels like. I don't think I've ever, like, you.

Car [01:04:07]:
Just stay on stacker news all day.

Keyan [01:04:09]:
I don't think I've ever been in a bull. I don't think I've ever, like, seen the entry into a bull run before. So I don't really know what it feels like. But if I had to get. It feels to me like nothing. Like it's nothing. Nothing's gonna happen. I don't think, I don't think, I don't.

Keyan [01:04:24]:
I don't think this bull run is gonna be like the other ones.

Car [01:04:26]:
Oh, so you think it's actually gonna be much. The price is gonna be much lower.

Keyan [01:04:31]:
I'm kind of interesting. I don't mean to be, I don't, I just think, I just don't think there's as much appetite.

Car [01:04:39]:
Oh, interesting. Do you think AI just ate most of it?

Keyan [01:04:44]:
I think there's some of that. I think they're. I just don't, I just don't see what. For what reason the ETF is there. People, if they want to buy it, it's pretty easy to do for them, maybe. I don't think we'll be printing that much money anytime soon. Think the economy is gonna be in a weird spot.

Car [01:05:04]:
So you see, you're canceling the bull run, is what you're saying.

Keyan [01:05:07]:
That's right. I'm canceling the bull run. You heard it here. Bull run.

Car [01:05:12]:
Super bearish.

Keyan [01:05:13]:
I don't, I mean bearish. I'm bullish on bitcoin. I'm, I don't, I just don't, I just.

Car [01:05:19]:
The price on payments.

Keyan [01:05:21]:
If you ask me about the price.

Car [01:05:22]:
Bearish on machine. Machine payments. Bearish.

Keyan [01:05:26]:
Yeah. I don't like lying to myself and other people about. Thanks. If I'm gonna, if I'm gonna lie, I'm gonna, I'm gonna under promise.

Car [01:05:34]:
Yes. I guess we're all line if I have to choose. Interesting. Wow.

Keyan [01:05:41]:
Well, yeah, but you're seeing eating up, so maybe it's gonna heat up.

Car [01:05:43]:
I feel like it's eating up, but.

Keyan [01:05:45]:
Why not, you know, I'm might have a bro, I probably have a broken temperature.

Car [01:05:50]:
I can see, I can see the whole point about it maybe not getting where we think it's gonna go. I could see that, like, I could see it break, breaking just 100 and that being the only thing. But I don't know, man. There's just a lot of more bullish news and more bullish things to get launched. But I could be wrong.

Keyan [01:06:09]:
Oh, I think products will continue. I think there's tons going on in the ecosystem. Lots of builders more and more, and great ones. Yeah. I just don't. Where does the money come from? Yeah, I don't, I don't really understand money very well. So what, I shouldn't even be allowed to speak, so don't count what I'm saying.

Car [01:06:35]:
Too late. We already did. Cool stackers. You go out there, you enjoy your time with your families. Eat some barbecue. Barbecue, eat some steak. Flip, turn on the grill and flip a car over. Drink, drink cold one and yeah, enjoy it.

Keyan [01:06:55]:
Coop tap. Bye.

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